You are the one with a claim to support! How about you quote the exact text that describes the process of isolating the virus from all other materials? Use the fact you cannot as a clue...
Virology uses the term isolation as a misnomer;
- doesn't match the strict scientific definitions of this term.
- suggests a complete separation that isn't actually achieved.
- implies a purity that does not exist in the samples.
Virology claims to isolate viruses when in fact it cannot.
This is not a matter of debate or interpretation:
- No virus has ever been physically isolated.
- No virus has ever been separated from host tissue.
- No virus has ever been purified from other cellular material.
- It is technically impossible with current methods.
- Virology acknowledges this while continuing to claim isolation
* This fundamental contradiction cannot be overstated:
* Virology has built an entire field on something it cannot demonstrate exists.
This is not a minor technical issue - it is a fatal flaw that undermines the entire field
Until now the no-virus proponents have defined the ballpark:
to prove that something is a virus, it needs to pass A, B and C with 100% scores, otherwise it is not a virus: the Cowan gold standard. These formalities are defined in such a way that no virus can ever qualify.
So easy peasy: viruses don't exist!
I am describing another ballpark based on 128 years old investigations by creative scientists based on pure logic, not formalities, when A, B and C did not even exist.
Yet you keep parroting ABC, that's fine, but please, deposit our useless smatterings on some other site, not here!
😀No one is stopping you from believing viruses exist in nature. Believe what you like. Btw “No virus camp” is box ticking nonsense, typical of state worshippers.
try “Proof that viruses exist in nature” camp.
It’s funny how, unlike real scientific disciplines, virology & “climate science™️” refuse to admit there is such a thing as THE scientific method.
Exactly Mees ,,And the inverse of that, is mistakes of belief are extremely difficult to acknowledge and let go of, when they have been the foundation of your lifes' work.
Hi. Pls Refer/link us to the actual method used by L to prove the existence (in nature) of a contagious, pathogenic & self replicating particle ? Thank you.
You say “science is not a dogmatically applied technique…”
I beg to differ. Sometimes it should be.
The whole point of a dogmatic approach is you MUST REPLICATE the findings of a previous experiment.
Then you do it again, and again.
Eventually, IF you can consistently replicate the results, you might begin to accept them as valid.
Of course, if you don't want to prove the dogma, just change the premise, the variables, loosen the controls and play foot-loose and fancey-free with the results - which is what ViroLIEgy does all the time.
Please cite specific papers on the dogmatic replication of the “results” obtained by Loeffler.
In my opinion, we go wrong when we miss the fact that the vast majority of people with the supposed ‘virus’ have no symptoms. To me, the question of isolation is irrelevant when 80-98% of sarscov2 hosts are healthy. For the people with actual symptoms, there are always diet, lifestyle, environmental stress factors which explain 100% of symptoms.
Please see the paper by Herman streeck which I mentioned in The proof of NO no-virus: only 15 % vs 3.1 % in the control group got infected in a super spreader event (of which 22% asymptomatic). That's because corona viruses have been in the flu mix for very long: it's an endemic disease. New mutants may occur or be lab made, but their is cross immunity. In general terms, all endemic disease agents have been losing virulence over the last century, the reason why we do not have to worry too much now, and vaccines are now unnecessary.
By the way, you method seems to be inspired by Tai Chi, in which my wife is a long time instructor.
Still, imo all of the symptoms are most rationally explained by other factors which are always present in the symptomatic. Diet, lifestyle, mindset, seasonal factors, environmental toxins, and other factors are always present and able to explain all the phenomena. I do not even need a microscope to explain any human symptom, let alone a convoluted hypothesis where so much of the real world data suggests it is implausible. It is 100% plausible that diet, lifestyle and stress account for 100% of the symptoms of ‘covid’ or any other supposedly pathogenic disease. When we also factor in malpractice, which is via protocol these days with remdesivir, ventilators, etc…we need no microbe to explain what we see imo.
And, yes, thank you for noticing! My Jing Palace method is based in dao yin practice, which is similar to tai chi but not martial, it is a self-healing practice. I bet your wife is a saint, and we are all very fortunate to have each other, I wish you both wellness ☯️
I agree that my wife (of 52 years) is a saint (we have seen great miracles in health recovery) but not on the disease.
The best explanation on covid disease is in Pierre Kory's The War on Ivermectin. They saw a new inflammatory syndrome (related to spike protein, ACE receptors etc), for which they had to create a new treatment protocol, which fortunately was very succesful. Although he doesn't mention it, these patients were of course often obese, with diabetes and other underlying comorbidities, etc.
I do of course agree that you can largely prevent health problems through lifestyle, diet and stress reduction, but it is increasingly difficult to avoid toxins. I have my own hens which eat a lot of organic garden greens but I can't get organic feed here (so there is GMO maiz and soya in it). Still they were never ill and never stopped laying for two years on a row. My wife bakes our masa madre bread, but we can't get organic flour, etc.
Well, it is good that we agree on the most important aspects and find ourselves grateful. As far as the idea that there was a new brand of disease, a new kind of inflammation, I just don’t buy it, and largely because I do not subscribe to the idea of diseases as brands or entities in this way. You may find it interesting, esp since your wife likes Tai Chi, to learn about the concept of pathogens in Traditional Chinese Medicine, whereby the disease-causing-thing or pathogen is an overall condition, like what we find in nature. For example, we develop pathogens like dampness, heat, wind, and others because of many factors combining: how we sleep, breathe, posture, mindset, movement, inputs etc…and when we are ‘damp’, it is not any single thing that causes our runny nose, muscle soreness, etc…but, rather it is the overall condition itself and the symptoms arise together with it. Make sense? I eschew all diagnosis outside of the TCM framework, so I do not subscribe to cold, flu, covid, aids, polio, etc…all of these are misunderstood imo.
The "spike protein" (sic.) arose from an aberrant lab process where the protein solvent Trypsin, was added to a cytopathic field which castellated the margins of particulate in that field.
Giving the appearance of spikes, in the electron microscope image.
The "spike protein" is a Fraudulently applied, artifact.
If a claimed virus (genetic material inside a protein and declared infectious and contagious) is to be prosecuted as extant...It must be isolated as an independent variable and tests done to prove the claims.
Absolutely. 👍The proof that no virus has ever been proven to exist in nature is in the method section of every virus isolation study in the literature.
Too general ? Methodology section of any virus isolation paper you care to look at.
You can see from the methodology section of every single study in the scientific literature that metagenomics are used, which “builds” a theoretical notion of a “virus” using artificial intelligence with no original to match against. This model is constructed from sequences detected in random cellular debris containing material taken from monkeys. (The result is admitted to be an “in silico sequence,” a “contrived virus,” “synthetic nucleotide technology,” or a “mimicked clinical specimen,” among other names.)
Though claimed in the medical literature to be a “complete sequence,” no part of any theoretical metagenomic script has ever been proven to come from a virus, match a virus, or cause any disease.
This article in question here is not a scientific study paper. It’s just an article.
If Loeffler was correct, it should be an easy task for you to provide valid replication studies of his findings, using exactly the same protocols as Loeffler. I'll wait...
What I have written on Loeffler's methods on my site is sufficient to judge his methods by logical standards.
If you want more info, please go to Wageningen University or these articles:
"Evolution of Virology: Science History through Milestones and Technological Advancements" (2024)
This article traces the development of virology, emphasizing key figures like Koch and Loeffler. It discusses how their work, along with advancements in filtration technology, contributed to the identification and understanding of viruses.
PubMed Central
"The First 'Virus Hunters'" (2017)
This historical piece explores the early discoveries in virology, highlighting the roles of Loeffler and others in identifying viruses as distinct infectious agents. It provides context on how these foundational studies set the stage for modern virology.
PubMed
"History of Virology" (2019)
Published in the Encyclopedia of Microbiology, this article offers a concise overview of virology's history, including the seminal work of Koch and Loeffler in establishing the field.
I have not dug into the specifics of FMD, but I have started investigating for myself another alleged cattle disease, trichomoniasis. In Texas, there is a requirement to test for this disease before selling breeding bulls.
I have a very small herd of Dexters (small Irish breed) and occasionally buy and sell breeding stock.
Here, the Texas Animal Health Commission is the regulating entity. Interestingly, the commission is made up of 13 political appointees. You are not invited unless you’re a big player who knows the governor.
You can see the AgriLife logo at the top of that fact sheet. And at the bottom is a list of references, about half of them can be found online for free, and the other half are either behind a paywall or can’t be found.
But please notice that the very first statement of “fact” has NO reference:
“Cattle Trichomoniasis or “trich” is a sexually transmitted disease of cattle caused by the organism Tritrichomonas foetus.”
The references I can find online also make that causality statement, as if it were proven, but provide no reference.
So, I FOIA’d TAMU.
Interestingly, they do not have any studies, reports, papers, ANYTHING (!), showing HOW they PROVED CAUSATION, and nothing showing how all other causes, environmental or otherwise, had been ruled out.
What they provided was a paper by one of their “experts” describing using the PCR method to detect the presence of the T. foetus organism in a sample collected from cattle and does not claim to provide proof that T. foetus is the cause of any disease and does not claim to be an investigation ruling out all other possible causes, environmental or otherwise.
And they provided a copy of the patent on the PCR process, also by the same “expert.” And it seems the PCR process, being one step removed from the culture process, can be “gamed” to provide whatever results needed.
Both documents make that same causality claim and fail to reference it.
I also FOIA’d the TAHC and the USDA, who has funded grants for some of the papers that failed to specify the source for the causality statement. I have received nothing from these agencies.
I discovered from reading the available papers that there are healthy animals that co-exist with this organism, and unhealthy/deceased animals (spontaneously aborted, infertile) who do not. So they cannot even show good correlation between the presence of the organism and the observed “disease.”
And because we are assured correlation does not equal causation, and extraordinary claims (of causation) require extraordinary evidence, then the lack of references for the causality statements is highly suspect.
What I also discovered in the papers I read, was that to diagnose an “infection,” and label the animal “diseased,” the ONLY requirement is that the T. foetus organism be found in a sample of bull smegma collected by a vet (likely trained at TAMU) and cultured in a lab (likely the one at TAMU).
And my perfectly healthy bull, merely on the basis of the presence of a particular organism, can be labeled “infected” and “diseased,” but “asymptomatic.”
And the TAHC, comprised of BIG AG political appointees, can then FORCE me to MURDER (“cull”) my perfectly healthy bull.
All based on that CAUSALITY statement that they have no proof for.
So, you can see, this is a means for the big players here to profit ($$ for the vet, $$ for the lab, $$ for the patent-holders, $$ for the university, etc.) AND a means to commit state-sponsored tyranny against small farmers (who ultimately pay all the $$) and restrict the competition from the small farmers, who cannot remove themselves from the BIG AG food system if they are forced to cull perfectly healthy breeding stock.
So, no, I refuse to participate in this genocide against an organism that should be innocent until PROVEN guilty (the relationship could be neutral or beneficial, but without a thorough investigation no one can say otherwise).
SHOW ME YOUR PROOF OF CAUSATION USING THE SCIENTIFIC METHOD, DEFINITIVELY RULING OUT ALL OTHER POSSIBLE CAUSES.
I am focused now on FMD, but a very brief comment. In Trichomonas infected herds, the bull will normally be a symptomless carrier and the most cows will clean themselves via immunity, and fertility can be normal. But if you sell the bull to an uninfected herd, embryonic mortality and venereal inflamations in the cows may happen. The buyer of a free herd will normally ask for a certificate, no idea why the state interferes. Well, in fact I know: everywhere in the West bureaucrats are taking over to make life in the countryside impossible. In Spain you can't have your own hens, and feeding a dead chicken to a farm dog can cost you an enormous fine (like E 50.000), other countries are advancing in the same direction.
It is part of the global domination plan that I describe in my book en articles.
“Symptomless,” or “asymptomatic,” means HEALTHY. They pulled that same BS with CON-VID.
They simply redefine words. A “positive” result from a “test” means NOTHING when the organism they are testing for is not PROVEN to be the CAUSE of anything. It’s a scam, a fraud. They freely admit they have no proof and have never done a thorough investigation to rule out other causes. They simply declare that T. foetus is THE CAUSE. That is NOT science. That’s DOGMA.
Again, feel free to read the available studies yourself. Normal healthy animals are found to carry the organism and animals that are infertile (or aborted) do not.
Note that this is a "Case Review" and not a scientific study. However, the Introduction paragraph makes this claim, "Tritrichomonas foetus, the causative organism," yet provides no citation.
Note that only 4.5% of aborted foetuses were positive. That means that 95.5% of abortions were negative. That is a very low correlation and not at all indicative of causation.
The Conclusion, "Our data collectively demonstrates that a percentage of cows/heifers that recently experienced abortion are positive for T. foetus and may play an important role in maintaining endemicity of bovine trichomoniasis."
Notice the language demonstrating a lack of correlation, as only a "percentage of cows" that aborted were positive.
They do not have SCIENTIFIC PROOF of anything. These papers do not even claim to be proof of anything.
They are playing word games, redefining “diseased” as simply a “positive” result from a test they gamed.
I’m no longer just playing along.
You can believe whatever the hell you want.
But the moment you, the scientific community, the government, or anyone else tries to pass off a belief as irrefutable scientific fact—or tries to coerce me or others into that belief system—you’d better be able to provide crystal-clear, irrefutable, empirical evidence for every cause-and-effect claim it rests on. Not models. Not expert consensus. Not majority opinion. Real, observable, testable evidence that follows the scientific method, step by step, for every single claim.
And if you can’t back it with real evidence, we don’t owe your belief a damn thing.
Yes, a symptomless animals is healthy... for now. It may even remain healthy for its entire life. Or a virus may cause problems at a later date.
I've been raising dairy goats for 42 years. With goats, there is a virus called Caprine arthritis encephalitis virus, or CAE. This virus seems to remain symptomless in some 80% of infected goats, but for the other 20% it can cause serious illness (wasting disease, crippling arthritis, infertility, mastistis, etc.) and death. It has also been observed that encephalitis caused by CAE tends to strike kids between the ages of 2 to 6 months although it can occur in older animals, while the arthritis tends to strike older does, usually between the ages of 7 and 8.
Since the primary way this virus spreads is from dam to kids through the colostrum and milk, the best way to prevent it (aside from keeping a CAE-free herd with no outbreeding... it can also be transmitted sexually although this is rare) is to remove the kids as soon as they're born and pasteurize the colostrum and milk before feeding it to them.
Now go ahead and tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about in spite of my experience as a goatherder.
I a very familiar with CAE. In the 80ties, a Dutch colleague imported to Mozambique a Nubian male lamb to improve local goats. In those days CAE was not yet well known, and the buck or herd where it came from had not been tested. In the end I reared it, but it never developed well. In the end it was was given a number of local does but the symptoms of CAE became evident in the buck. It was decided to kill off the whole herd, as CAE was supposedly not present in the country.
When in Costa Rica, I had a cheese plant and made very good cheeses, also of bought goat milk. I then tried to set up a CAE free herd by first detecting free herds and than buying up animals. But CAE won. The CAE positive herd was moved to another farm, had many positive animals but never clinical problems.
Antibody tests are not only highly cross reactive it is an acknowledged problem that lot-to-lot tests are unreliable. The reproducibility crisis in science affects antibody test kits too. Also in theory that could just as well demonstrate "immunity" not "persistent infection."
Just as the honest "science" Kory and colleagues did on the Covid battle field, versus the many dishonest CRT studies on ivermectin showing that it had no effect.
Well, I was talking about how, as you said in one of your post, the information space is cluttered with misinformation, disinformation, and complete science fantasy lies and such. Before say the 1950's it was at least easier to sort the wheat from the chaff.
Whether or not viruses are real or imaginary, I tend to disagree with your final statement: "But artificially enhanced or modified human and zoonotic viruses still represent a great danger!" I think the danger comes for the deliberate murder of millions (soon to be billions) of people by (as you call them) the Glafia (globalist elite). Fear of "Disease X", supposedly caused by a deadly virus, as the excuse for government enforced weapons of mass vaccination.
1964: Club of Rome founder Aurelio Peccei and banker David Rockefeller meet in Williamsburg, VA, at Bilderberg Conference to begin the merger between globalist finance and worldwide population reduction.
1990s: Rapid development of vaccines as what billionaires view as a means of societal control, Big Pharma enrichment, and population reduction through a vast drop in male fertility, threatening mankind. Also, growth of stress-related chronic illness, deaths from iatrogenic causes, and deaths and injuries from adverse drug reactions, including explosion of autism in children.
2009: The “Good Club,” a gathering of U.S. billionaires led by Bill Gates, David Rockefeller, and George Soros meets at Rockefeller University in New York to continue planning for worldwide population reduction. Group has been meeting for a decade.
2020: On January 30, the World Health Organization announces a global emergency due to spread of COVID-19. On March 13, President Donald Trump declares a nationwide emergency and issues an additional travel ban on non-U.S. citizens traveling from 26 European countries due to what many will later call the COVID-19 “Plandemic.” Introduction of mRNA vaccines results in millions of excess deaths worldwide. COVID lockdowns shatter U.S. economy, destroying small businesses and causing massive unemployment.
2023: Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., launches campaign for the presidency of the U.S., seeking first the Democratic nomination but switching to becoming an independent after being blocked from participation in Democratic Party primaries. Kennedy had published best-selling exposé of the misdeeds of Anthony Fauci in his book, The Real Anthony Fauci, Bill Gates, Big Pharma, and the Global War on Democracy, and Public Health.
2024: Evidence continues to mount worldwide that billions of people have been poisoned by COVID vax, leading to rising death tolls from turbo-cancers, myocarditis and heart failure, amyloidosis, and “Long-COVID” effects. Deaths and injuries have also resulted from COVID medical treatment protocols, denial of known COVID remedies, and Draconian lockdown policies. Evidence also rises of aggressive globalist plans to crash world economy via carbon-capture, banning of meat, sequestering of farmland, and other attacks on the world food supply.
This brings us to the inescapable observation that the quintessence of the Empire’s plan has been to assure the permanent wealth and power of its ruling billionaires by drastic reductions in the world’s population. The process has been underway since the 1960s, when it was discovered that gain-of-function bioengineering could be performed on viruses to make them more lethal(* see below). The population could also then be frightened into taking an increasing diet of harmful vaccines. {Richard C. Cook}
(*)A psy-op weapon is only useful when shrouded in secrecy and prohibition, i.e. “rattled” and not deployed. The secrecy and prohibition also encourage fantastical doomsday mythology, helpfully stoked by the Hollywood’s predictive programming material. Human imagination is the most powerful weapon in existence, and the key to using it against others is to create catchy fake narratives about secret weapons programs that you may or may not have, and then let others convince themselves on your behalf and are forced to act along the predicted policies and incentives.
Thus, tales of gain-of-function (GOF) viruses that are kept in secret biolabs are one of the most effective fake stories to ever infect (see what I did here?) the human narrative spaces.
Finally, I do not accept arguments “but they have all the secret science and secret research in secret biolabs in Ukraine, etc. etc.” There is no evidence of any working GOF, but lots of evidence of the PCR/DNA modeling bullshit used to generate virus fearporn and clickbait, both in peer review literature and on social media. {Sasha Latypova}
Sorry Mark, I did not read your comment on the danger of bioweapons vs. a newly created virus/vax well. This is a war on many fronts, and we should not exclude any as we try to look in future risks.
The book L’Avenir De La Vie {“The Future of Life” (1981) ~ Michel Salomon} quotes Jacques Attali, adviser to French President François Mitterrand:
“In the future it will be about finding a way to reduce the population. We will start with the old, because as soon as he is over 60-65 years of age, man lives longer than he produced and costs society dearly. Then the weak and then the useless who do nothing for society because there will be more and more of them, and especially finally the stupid ones.”
”... euthanasia will have to be an essential instrument of our future societies, in all cases. Of course, we cannot execute people or set up camps. We will get rid of them by making them believe it is for their own good. Too large a population, and for the most part unnecessary, is something economically too expensive.”
“We will find something to cause it, a pandemic that targets certain people, a real economic crisis or not, a virus that will affect the old or the obese, it doesn’t matter, the weak will succumb to it, the fearful and the stupid will believe it and ask to be treated. We will have taken care to have planned the treatment, a treatment that will be the solution. The selection of idiots will thus be done by themselves: they will go to the slaughterhouse on their own." {Robin Westenra Substack (September 2024)}.
Reportedly, Henry Kissinger said something similar at a 1990s conference: that once people are made to accept vaccines, it’s “game over.”
Hi Robert, FMD may affect all cloven-hoofed animals, domestic and wild.
It can survive for a long time in recovered animals, see van Bekkum, J. G. 1959. Observation on the carrier state of cattle exposed to FMDV. Tijdschr. Diergeneeskd. 84; 1159-1164. and Fogedby, E. 1963. Review of epizootiology and control of foot-and-mouth disease in Europe 1937 to 1961. European commision for the control of foot-and-mouth disease, food and agricultural organisation of the United Nations, Rome, 1963.
It can be spread by the wind over dozens of kilometers. In Holland, most outbreaks used to be in the summer months, when the cattle were day and night in pasture, a season in which many other diseases disappear.
AS far as I know only immunity after vaccination of disease protects, but their are several types and strains without cross immunity.
Anyone claiming that "a disease" "was known about" in the 1600s, 1700s, 1400s, etc. that would be comparable to "a disease" "identified" in the 1800s or 1900s is making wild claims. Symptoms, maybe, yes.
The symptoms are very specific. It is however similar to vesicular stomatitis (also due to a virus), but the former does not infect horses, while the latter does.
Interestingly enough at the time FMD was discovered people were enthusiastically submerging their livestock in arsenic-based livestock dips (e.g., Cooper's sheep dip) and administering arsenic based anti-pesticidal medications, and spraying the ever-living 💩 out of their food, livestock feed, and soil with arsenic-based pesticides. Which is funny because dermal and ingested arsenic poisoning can cause a wide variety of symptoms in humans and animals identical to various pox diseases, necrotic anthrax-like or even FMD-like skin lesions, cancers, keratosis, measles-type rashes, nerve damage, and we could go on.
Thought to be totally safe at the time, we now understand that these chemicals enthusiastically used from the 1850s to 1980s (!!) are extraordinarily toxic, can cause both chronic and acute disease, and are prone to environmental accumulation that has led to persistent soil and water poisoning to this day.
And that's just the arsenic. Lord knows how many other toxic junk chemicals people and livestock were being exposed to at the time, whether accidentally (industrial pollution) or on purpose (some purported miracle cure or "totally safe herb/pesticide").
Guaranteed controlling for environmental toxins was never - and almost still has never - been accounted for in past or current "virus" studies.
One also wonders if they did "controls" of a more basic nature: e.g., does injecting non-"infected" diluted lymph into animal tongues cause lesions, and so on. It's actually quite likely that grinding up some lymph or tongue from a healthy animal and injecting it into your or an animals tongues would "make it sick." Having looked into rabies, influenza, polio, measles, and varicella, I'm going to confidently guess the answer for FMD is: "no".
I appreciate your inquiry, a rare event in these discussions! FMD has been known for centuries, long before large scale applications of pesticides.
Loeffler was the first researcher who showed that the causal agent is not a toxin, but a very small replicating (bio)particle (original documents in German). If you have a sufficiently virulent strain, you can inject a first animal (say a calf of 200 kg) with 1/10.000 ml of infected lymph, than from the second 200 kg animal the same quantity to the third, and so on, and on. A toxin would be extremely diluted in such passages and lose its toxicity, which is dose dependent.
Loeffler used the term lymph for the clear fluid in the FMD lesion (blister) on the tongue (so not as a generic term). Injections of non-FMD material (including blood or serum) have never resulted in the disease, which normally (virulence may vary in different types and strains of the virus) spreads like fire to other cattle or pigs in the affected herd or area.
The arguments used today by no-virus leaders on the only way a virus could be isolated are thus obsolete: Loeffler already proved it, although he could not see the particles. We now know this virus at the atomic level, including its genome, see the last article mentioned in this post.
I think perhaps the cause is unhygienic conditions when animals are confined in captivity. If you have to stamp around in your own urine and feces and have a lesion on your foot or tongue? The disease typically spreads between animals through direct contact. This would mean FMD is less common in wild deer, pigs, antelopes, gazelles, goats etc.
I put this forward in terms of the cause of human bubonic plague (black death):
"Anaphylaxis explains both natural outbreaks of “contagious illness” in human history and chronic illness in modern western populations. Because normally people carry the plague bacteria and cholera bacteria in their intestines and it's no problem. But when rats, lice and fleas were common, their bites carried proteins found in sewage. In effect bites were the equivalent of being "vaccinated"; and enough bites would cause an “epidemic” of the plague/ smallpox/ cholera etc."
Mark and Others - All the points raised here are well-taken. They all help to paint the bigger picture.
Bottom line, from my POV: Once humankind created Agriculture and Animal Husbandry, which are both strictly (and severely) anti-natural practices, humankind has been fighting Nature ever since. Deliberately upsetting natural, optimal balances in countless ways, of course we find ourselves confronted with all manner of symptoms and diseases, due to perverted imbalances we have created.
Anti-natural practices = unpleasant consequences.
That's Natural Law in action.
As it should be.
Arguing over details, whilst blithely continuing our anti-natural practices, appears ridiculous, delusional, and certainly counter-productive.
In the end, Nature will win. Guaranteed.
Best if we stop the war now.
What to do about it?
The sensible answer is to carefully study how Nature wants to do things, and biomimic those techniques. IOW, do everything we can to rehabilitate natural ecosystems, along with our own lifestyle practices to be in much better harmony with Nature's methods.
More likely some kind of poison producing so-called FMD symptoms. Arsenic could be one culprit, or one of the other dangerous chemical/heavy metal contaminents in use. By the 1920s fertiliser use had taken hold and fertilised fields deprive animals of the full complement of minerals needed for optimal health and longevity.
There is no proof for viruses. The virus hoax is the number one thing keeping humanity in chains.
Dr Sam Bailey has some excellent content, read her book Virus Mania. Ditto the book The Contagion Myth. Anthony Colpo on substack -"Viruses don't exist, deal with it", well worth your time.
"Pseudoscience consists of statements, beliefs, or practices that claim to be both scientific and factual but are incompatible with the scientific method"
"Pseudoscience describes any belief system or methodology which tries to gain legitimacy by wearing the trappings of science but fails to abide by the rigorous methodology and standards of evidence that are the marks of true science.
Promoters of pseudoscience often adopt scientific vocabulary, describing conjectures as hypotheses, theories, or laws, providing "evidence" from observation and "expert" testimonies, or even developing what appear to be mathematical models of their ideas. However, in pseudoscience, there is no honest attempt to follow the scientific method, provide falsifiable predictions, or develop double-blind experiments.
Although pseudoscience is designed to appear scientific, it lacks all of the substance of science."
Yes I agree, an excellent description of the no virus theory!
This is what I just wrote to guy wants me to debate Mike Stone (no idea who he is):
as I have explained ad nauseam, no-virus uses a "science trick", similar to what Fauci and Pharmafia do: they define a set of arbitrary hurdles, ABC.., for a virus to pass, in such a way that no virus can ever pass (I call it the Cowan gold standard). ABC are time-bound and technique-bound. Then they conclude: easy peasy, viruses don't exist.
I have certainly no interest to participate in a debate where the dogma is ABC, and then ABC, and again, ABC.
But I will participate in a debate where Loeffler's method is critically analyzed to see if there are logical fallacies. Logic is not time-bound and not technique-bound. As is science.
Mike Stone belongs to "the club". He's one of those big names in "no-virus".
Let's hope you will reject his offer. Personally I don't see much value in debating virology. If you would want to engage in any discussions, at least talk to honest people.
It's nice to hear you agree that science does prescribe the scientific method.
ABC is not science, but arbitrary scientism. When you say it's not a theory, you mean that it is the truth. And not just a truth, a truth that cannot be discussed. Great science!
and by the way, in a scientific discussion, you should have excused yourself for your ridiculous comment on wild animals!
As regards the science trick of making viruses impossible to prove I disagree. The scientific method is designed so that people can't just go round saying there's evidence for a thing when there isn't.
Mike Stone does not mention the proof that the agent replicates in the host. That is only one of the big lies by team no-virus.
I do not have time to answer your 15 comment in 12 hours,, here is my standard comment (but I will read them all to see if there is any new argument in it).
Dear commenter
I have been answering hundreds of comments on my no-virus articles and was often insulted. I have made two conclusions, which are now my standard answer (personalized answers will be the exception):
1. The leaders of team no-virus are clearly acting in bad faith: all their publications are misleading and riddled with contradictions, falsifications, omissions, etc. These errors can’t be random and the only explanation that I can give is that they are part of a psy-op, set up and financed by The Powers That Be. That is nothing new: it has been seen in all opposition movements, i.e., cognitive infiltration as described by Cass Sunstein: … agents should join those online communities and promote a wide range of additional theories, often rather absurd ones, thereby stirring up internal conflicts, diverting the members into theoretical dead-ends, and heavily discrediting them with the broader public.
2. The followers of team no-virus often make ad hominem attacks, probably because they learned it from Tom Cowan, and because their backgrounds in medicine and virological science are – with rare exceptions – insufficient for an academic discussion. Yet their attitude is rarely humble. For the same reason they are also unable to spot the enormous deceit by the leaders. Most of these rude attackers have a quite recent substack account without original posts, but with a facade of restacks. Some have even offered me money, or cooperation with their leaders in research projects. Again, all of this smells psy-op.
And of course, nobody has taken the Loeffler challenge. Please tell me what else can explain his results, if not a virus (a submicroscopic agent replicating in the host)?
On the misleading publications:
After a quick screening I spotted 3 mayor deceptions in Can you catch a cold, see my post The proof of NO no-virus.
I am not saying that Covid was not a hoax or a scam (it was), or that vaccines are good (they are dangerous and largely unnecessary), or that viruses are a mayor health risk for humans (that was long ago), or that the pharmaceutical industry is benevolent: in my book I call them Pharmafia: the New Merchants of Death. I am just saying that viruses do exist (including Covid19), that they can be modified into bioweapons, and that anti-viral drugs can be lifesaving.
I don't care what Mike Stone does or doesn't say, you're talking to me.
Let me try and explain it like this. Say a toxin, stress or malnutrition causes the body to protect itself with blisters. You mash up the affected area which contains all the cellular stimulants to produce blisters and directly inject (or some other unnatural transmission route) into another animal of the same species (or different) and hey presto blisters are produced. You then mash up the affected area of the second animal and using the same dilution of the cellular stimulants inject into a third animal and hey presto, what a surprise get blisters.
The ‘agent’ does not replicate in the host? You understand the concept of hormones, mRNA and cell messaging etc. The stimulus causes the body to react in a certain way - make a runny nose etc. If these were transferred to another organism they may well cause a runny nose.
To have something to eat requires the thing, without the thing, there's nothing to eat. What do virologists put on the plate? Nothing. There are three lines of evidence which they say points to the thing, but not the thing itself. Your argument is a screaming nonsense.
Total trash bro. You really can’t let get go of the viral delusion. That’s because you also still think you live on a ridiculous spinning, spiraling ball zooming through an ever expanding vacuum of space at beyond mind blowing speeds. Take a deep breath, it’s so simple. The earth does not move and viruses are not the cause of disease. The rest is for you to figure out, but I doubt you ever will.
A living and replicating life form that causes disease that you call a virus does not exist. You are the one making the baseless claim. All the procedures are based on flawed assumptions and procedures like all virology. You have not proved anything. I do not, and shall not prove that something doesn't exist. All the information on this ridiculous viral nonsense has been thoroughly dismantled. I am not wasting my breath on you. You have nothing just like all that went before you. You are part of the problem, fuelling the useless poisons as a solution. You are afraid to take responsibility for your own health choices, and need a terrorist to blame. You have learned nothing during the last 5 years of the Convid Scamdemic farce. Not one virus has EVER EVER EVER been ISOLATED, never mind proven to cause disease.
Hi Mees, I wonder if that 1916 New York poliovirus outbreak may have actually been the result of testing vaccines. I have gone through some of the Rockefeller reports from around that time and those scientist were doing many "interesting" and unethical experiments. Since this was originally blamed on a group of immigrants, I wondered if vaccines were administered on Ellis Island. Turns out that "by 1916 the Ellis Island laboratory routinely prepared vaccines". I could not find out for what. But given that vaccines were widely tested on service members, incarcerated individual, orphans and the like - I would not put it past them. Millions were coming through and they could justify such experiments on this "lower class of people" as for the greater good.
Suzanne Humpfries says that the lab had the Rockefeller given task to develop a highly lethal poliovirus type (just an accident, but maybe for fear mongering, to make people receptive to vaccines). I cite her, so maybe you can ask her. The problems with the polio vaccines are from much later, the 50ties (Salk). All very well explained in Suzanne's book.
Yes I have read her book. What I was trying to find out is were they running vaccine trials for polio at this time. But they were testing vaccines for all sorts of diseases. Chas. M Higgins book (1920) "Horrors of Vaccination Exposed and Illustrated :Petition to the President to abolish compulsory vaccination in the Army and Navy - detailed some of these practices at the time. Many unknowns - Thanks
Yes, Covid was not the first compulsary vaccination. Yesterday I read somewhere that compulsary vaccination for Smallpox in the UK was abolished in 1898! Vax rates drops, yet the disease was quickly retreating.
Don't rule out pollution and pesticides. The Western world spend about 150 years spewing arsenic, lead, and other toxic heavy metals into drinking water, into and onto livestock, onto crops, into the soil, into lumber, into paints and dyes and fabrics, into detergents, and into cosmetics. Either via chemical spills or especially under the guise of pesticides. To say nothing of the "medicines" of the time (mercury, arsenic, etc.) and the ridiculous "tests" used to "diagnose disease", or the "mercury based teething salts" people liked to give babies, and so on.
There's a million and one possible explanations given people's enthusiasm for drenching themselves in highly toxic chemicals.
Hi Mees, could any infection be caused by toxins resulting from the actual method of transmission rather than assuming the presence of a virus just as adjuvants can be problematic with vaccine production.
Merely Mees, that in any experiment there is a chance of an error due to extraneous circumstances like contamination. The lymph extraction and purification can lead to corrupted results with misleading conclusions. The COVID test had a noticeable error rate which completely skewed the interpretation of a positive test.
"The lymph extraction and purification can lead to corrupted results with misleading conclusions."
Yes, that's why they took hygienic measures in the collection and filtered the bacteria out, and added several tests for sterility mentioned in the original articles, not in mine. (and in the US document too if I remember well). They were totally aware that this could happen and treated it with "Deutsche Grundlichkeit".
An observation made by Loeffler is that even when a lymph was contaminated, passage through one or more animals would rapidly clear it.
You know it's virtually impossible to get published without being in line with pharma dogma. Pharma was very happy to ban and thus create a market for IVM and get those rejecting the jabs popping it like sweets.
What is your picture of? They look like ladybirds or some sort of bugs. Why does it say VIRAL LOAD underneath. What paper is it from? What is it stained with and what's the magnification? If they're meant to be viruses and it's EM you know that electrons only produce a negative impression in black and white so it's been colourised?
Your 128 year old lesson in virology teaches us how the scientific method can be subverted. It does not prove the existence of replication competent transmissible pathogenic particles.
Blisters, spots and fever are, of course, the body's way of healing, detoxing and protecting itself from whatever assaults are involved in farming animals. They are produced by the body itself. Taking filtered lymph from blisters will contain the substances, micro RNA and protein or whatever, that cause the healing mechanisms.
Injecting, scarifying or ingesting these substances will, of course, cause the same reactions in others, or symptoms may be as a result of the assault of injection, scarification or ingestion. Controls were not done 'infecting' animals with fluid from blisters thought not to be caused by FMD virus etc.
Animals also communicate with each other by visual and many other cues to detox so 'natural' means of transmission, like yawning, can appear 'contagious'.
Yes, passage of these substances through different species of cell would make them more 'virulent' ie reacting to the stress of all the toxins and stresses used in the abnormal process of cell culture.
The substances that act like 'HIV" can only be produced by treating cell cultures in a certain way.
That's a logical fallacy Mees...it not only avoids my question, but it also sets up the proposition that not reading the text is proof of the texts' veracity.
No:
The Triad of Scientific Certainty: These principles are non-negotiable:
- Isolation = Prove existence.
- Independent Variable = Prove cause.
- True Controls = Validate conclusions.
Therefore, in virology, we must:
- Isolate the virus (prove it exists).
- Test the virus alone (prove it acts).
- Compare to a true negative (prove nothing else acts).
* Violate one, violate all.
This is the challenge that faces virology...
Virology uses the term isolation as a misnomer;
- doesn't match the strict scientific definitions of this term.
- suggests a complete separation that isn't actually achieved.
- implies a purity that does not exist in the samples.
Virology claims to isolate viruses when in fact it cannot.
This is not a matter of debate or interpretation:
- No virus has ever been physically isolated.
- No virus has ever been separated from host tissue.
- No virus has ever been purified from other cellular material.
- It is technically impossible with current methods.
- Virology acknowledges this while continuing to claim isolation
* This fundamental contradiction cannot be overstated:
* Virology has built an entire field on something it cannot demonstrate exists.
This is not a minor technical issue - it is a fatal flaw that undermines the entire field.
An isolated virus as defined within virology is always in the presence of;
- Cellular debris.
- Various proteins.
- Other biological materials.
- Genetic material from multiple sources.
* Cannot fulfill the requirements to be an Independent Variable.
With each virus we study:
- We never have a pure sample.
- We're always working with complex mixtures.
- We can't definitively separate viral components from other materials.
- We can't fulfil the strict definition of isolation or purification.
The Core Issue:
If we cannot truly isolate a virus, then we cannot establish with certainty:
- What genetic material belongs to it.
- What proteins are uniquely its own.
- What effects it specifically causes.
*Virology as a valid science begins and ends here. R.I.P.
There you go, the science.
science is not a dogmatically applied technique, see the Larouche quote.
Loeffler followed a totally logical path and isolated the virus physically with rather primitive tools, please specify where he went wrong.
You are the one with a claim to support! How about you quote the exact text that describes the process of isolating the virus from all other materials? Use the fact you cannot as a clue...
Virology uses the term isolation as a misnomer;
- doesn't match the strict scientific definitions of this term.
- suggests a complete separation that isn't actually achieved.
- implies a purity that does not exist in the samples.
Virology claims to isolate viruses when in fact it cannot.
This is not a matter of debate or interpretation:
- No virus has ever been physically isolated.
- No virus has ever been separated from host tissue.
- No virus has ever been purified from other cellular material.
- It is technically impossible with current methods.
- Virology acknowledges this while continuing to claim isolation
* This fundamental contradiction cannot be overstated:
* Virology has built an entire field on something it cannot demonstrate exists.
This is not a minor technical issue - it is a fatal flaw that undermines the entire field
Congratulations, you are a great parrot of the dogmas your masters taught you!
Pity that there is not a speck of originality in it!
Until now the no-virus proponents have defined the ballpark:
to prove that something is a virus, it needs to pass A, B and C with 100% scores, otherwise it is not a virus: the Cowan gold standard. These formalities are defined in such a way that no virus can ever qualify.
So easy peasy: viruses don't exist!
I am describing another ballpark based on 128 years old investigations by creative scientists based on pure logic, not formalities, when A, B and C did not even exist.
Yet you keep parroting ABC, that's fine, but please, deposit our useless smatterings on some other site, not here!
Or tell me where Loeffler went wrong!
Dear Mees,
You keep using the logical fallacy of argument from ignorance.
And btw, yesterday, I waved my magic fallacy wand and PRESTO, no bombs were dropped on Iceland.
Now, YOU prove that my magic did NOT prevent those bombs!
Tell me where my flicking style did NOT prevent the launch?
My methods were sound.
habeas corpus Mees ..If you cannot bring the body to the court, you cannot prosecute it
😀No one is stopping you from believing viruses exist in nature. Believe what you like. Btw “No virus camp” is box ticking nonsense, typical of state worshippers.
try “Proof that viruses exist in nature” camp.
It’s funny how, unlike real scientific disciplines, virology & “climate science™️” refuse to admit there is such a thing as THE scientific method.
I am going to block you, I love the parrots in the woods here, but don't want them on my side
Would you be of a character type who would block anyone who used such a response as that one you just deposed?
I agree I banned this Ronald to early, but mistakes happen when you respond to hundreds of comments
Exactly Mees ,,And the inverse of that, is mistakes of belief are extremely difficult to acknowledge and let go of, when they have been the foundation of your lifes' work.
Hi. Pls Refer/link us to the actual method used by L to prove the existence (in nature) of a contagious, pathogenic & self replicating particle ? Thank you.
You say “science is not a dogmatically applied technique…”
I beg to differ. Sometimes it should be.
The whole point of a dogmatic approach is you MUST REPLICATE the findings of a previous experiment.
Then you do it again, and again.
Eventually, IF you can consistently replicate the results, you might begin to accept them as valid.
Of course, if you don't want to prove the dogma, just change the premise, the variables, loosen the controls and play foot-loose and fancey-free with the results - which is what ViroLIEgy does all the time.
Please cite specific papers on the dogmatic replication of the “results” obtained by Loeffler.
His papers are iin German, if you want them please give me your email
Unfortunately, German is a language I cannot read, especially a scientific paper.
I don't mean to be parochial but I understood English to be the accepted language for science to be published in.
Like aviation, there has to be transparent understanding or planes crash. I hope there hasn't been a metaphorical scientific crash.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWmRj1WWrSQ
Here is something in English that may be Germain..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWmRj1WWrSQ
Where he went wrong was, he did NOT, isolate a virus.
He presumed to isolate a desired characteristic outcome ..and whatever he "isolated he arbitrarily declared a contagious, infectious agent.
And Kochs' Postulates are a set of rules required to prove something.
Simply applying the name: Kochs' Postulates to a proposition, is not proof of anything.
He didn't isolate as in purify the virus physically. The filtrate contained god knows what.
In my opinion, we go wrong when we miss the fact that the vast majority of people with the supposed ‘virus’ have no symptoms. To me, the question of isolation is irrelevant when 80-98% of sarscov2 hosts are healthy. For the people with actual symptoms, there are always diet, lifestyle, environmental stress factors which explain 100% of symptoms.
Please see the paper by Herman streeck which I mentioned in The proof of NO no-virus: only 15 % vs 3.1 % in the control group got infected in a super spreader event (of which 22% asymptomatic). That's because corona viruses have been in the flu mix for very long: it's an endemic disease. New mutants may occur or be lab made, but their is cross immunity. In general terms, all endemic disease agents have been losing virulence over the last century, the reason why we do not have to worry too much now, and vaccines are now unnecessary.
By the way, you method seems to be inspired by Tai Chi, in which my wife is a long time instructor.
Still, imo all of the symptoms are most rationally explained by other factors which are always present in the symptomatic. Diet, lifestyle, mindset, seasonal factors, environmental toxins, and other factors are always present and able to explain all the phenomena. I do not even need a microscope to explain any human symptom, let alone a convoluted hypothesis where so much of the real world data suggests it is implausible. It is 100% plausible that diet, lifestyle and stress account for 100% of the symptoms of ‘covid’ or any other supposedly pathogenic disease. When we also factor in malpractice, which is via protocol these days with remdesivir, ventilators, etc…we need no microbe to explain what we see imo.
And, yes, thank you for noticing! My Jing Palace method is based in dao yin practice, which is similar to tai chi but not martial, it is a self-healing practice. I bet your wife is a saint, and we are all very fortunate to have each other, I wish you both wellness ☯️
I agree that my wife (of 52 years) is a saint (we have seen great miracles in health recovery) but not on the disease.
The best explanation on covid disease is in Pierre Kory's The War on Ivermectin. They saw a new inflammatory syndrome (related to spike protein, ACE receptors etc), for which they had to create a new treatment protocol, which fortunately was very succesful. Although he doesn't mention it, these patients were of course often obese, with diabetes and other underlying comorbidities, etc.
I do of course agree that you can largely prevent health problems through lifestyle, diet and stress reduction, but it is increasingly difficult to avoid toxins. I have my own hens which eat a lot of organic garden greens but I can't get organic feed here (so there is GMO maiz and soya in it). Still they were never ill and never stopped laying for two years on a row. My wife bakes our masa madre bread, but we can't get organic flour, etc.
Well, it is good that we agree on the most important aspects and find ourselves grateful. As far as the idea that there was a new brand of disease, a new kind of inflammation, I just don’t buy it, and largely because I do not subscribe to the idea of diseases as brands or entities in this way. You may find it interesting, esp since your wife likes Tai Chi, to learn about the concept of pathogens in Traditional Chinese Medicine, whereby the disease-causing-thing or pathogen is an overall condition, like what we find in nature. For example, we develop pathogens like dampness, heat, wind, and others because of many factors combining: how we sleep, breathe, posture, mindset, movement, inputs etc…and when we are ‘damp’, it is not any single thing that causes our runny nose, muscle soreness, etc…but, rather it is the overall condition itself and the symptoms arise together with it. Make sense? I eschew all diagnosis outside of the TCM framework, so I do not subscribe to cold, flu, covid, aids, polio, etc…all of these are misunderstood imo.
The "spike protein" (sic.) arose from an aberrant lab process where the protein solvent Trypsin, was added to a cytopathic field which castellated the margins of particulate in that field.
Giving the appearance of spikes, in the electron microscope image.
The "spike protein" is a Fraudulently applied, artifact.
You forgot to mention generational and regular and episodic vaccines as another cause of symptoms.
If a claimed virus (genetic material inside a protein and declared infectious and contagious) is to be prosecuted as extant...It must be isolated as an independent variable and tests done to prove the claims.
THAT, has never been done ....EVER.
Absolutely. 👍The proof that no virus has ever been proven to exist in nature is in the method section of every virus isolation study in the literature.
this is far too general for the present discussion!
please tell me where Loeffler went wrong!
Too general ? Methodology section of any virus isolation paper you care to look at.
You can see from the methodology section of every single study in the scientific literature that metagenomics are used, which “builds” a theoretical notion of a “virus” using artificial intelligence with no original to match against. This model is constructed from sequences detected in random cellular debris containing material taken from monkeys. (The result is admitted to be an “in silico sequence,” a “contrived virus,” “synthetic nucleotide technology,” or a “mimicked clinical specimen,” among other names.)
Though claimed in the medical literature to be a “complete sequence,” no part of any theoretical metagenomic script has ever been proven to come from a virus, match a virus, or cause any disease.
This article in question here is not a scientific study paper. It’s just an article.
Please list the method used by Loeffler to prove there is any pathogenic, contagious & self replicating particle present ??
there is a large body of science on FMD, many publications on this site, and you can send your questions to dr. Aldo Dekker
https://www.wur.nl/en/research-results/research-institutes/bioveterinary-research/animal-diseases/virology/foot-and-mouth-disease-2.htm
Dont say there's a large body…blabla.
Give us ONE scientific paper proving the existence of viruses. Just one.
But you wont
If Loeffler was correct, it should be an easy task for you to provide valid replication studies of his findings, using exactly the same protocols as Loeffler. I'll wait...
there is a large body of science on FMD, many publications on this site, and you can send your questions to dr. Aldo Dekker
https://www.wur.nl/en/research-results/research-institutes/bioveterinary-research/animal-diseases/virology/foot-and-mouth-disease-2.htm
What a cunning wriggle you display there. So robust until it comes to actually supporting your assertions.
Now you have papers in German and you bring a vetinerary researcher into the mix.
I'm not asking him. I'm asking you, Mees Baaijen.
What I have written on Loeffler's methods on my site is sufficient to judge his methods by logical standards.
If you want more info, please go to Wageningen University or these articles:
"Evolution of Virology: Science History through Milestones and Technological Advancements" (2024)
This article traces the development of virology, emphasizing key figures like Koch and Loeffler. It discusses how their work, along with advancements in filtration technology, contributed to the identification and understanding of viruses.
PubMed Central
"The First 'Virus Hunters'" (2017)
This historical piece explores the early discoveries in virology, highlighting the roles of Loeffler and others in identifying viruses as distinct infectious agents. It provides context on how these foundational studies set the stage for modern virology.
PubMed
"History of Virology" (2019)
Published in the Encyclopedia of Microbiology, this article offers a concise overview of virology's history, including the seminal work of Koch and Loeffler in establishing the field.
PubMed Central
G O L D 🏆
I have not dug into the specifics of FMD, but I have started investigating for myself another alleged cattle disease, trichomoniasis. In Texas, there is a requirement to test for this disease before selling breeding bulls.
I have a very small herd of Dexters (small Irish breed) and occasionally buy and sell breeding stock.
Here, the Texas Animal Health Commission is the regulating entity. Interestingly, the commission is made up of 13 political appointees. You are not invited unless you’re a big player who knows the governor.
https://www.tahc.texas.gov/
https://www.tahc.texas.gov/animal_health/cattle/
It appears that the “scientific” information on this disease comes from Texas A&M:
https://www.tahc.texas.gov/news/brochures/TAHCBrochure_TrichFemaleCattle.pdf
You can see the AgriLife logo at the top of that fact sheet. And at the bottom is a list of references, about half of them can be found online for free, and the other half are either behind a paywall or can’t be found.
But please notice that the very first statement of “fact” has NO reference:
“Cattle Trichomoniasis or “trich” is a sexually transmitted disease of cattle caused by the organism Tritrichomonas foetus.”
The references I can find online also make that causality statement, as if it were proven, but provide no reference.
So, I FOIA’d TAMU.
Interestingly, they do not have any studies, reports, papers, ANYTHING (!), showing HOW they PROVED CAUSATION, and nothing showing how all other causes, environmental or otherwise, had been ruled out.
What they provided was a paper by one of their “experts” describing using the PCR method to detect the presence of the T. foetus organism in a sample collected from cattle and does not claim to provide proof that T. foetus is the cause of any disease and does not claim to be an investigation ruling out all other possible causes, environmental or otherwise.
And they provided a copy of the patent on the PCR process, also by the same “expert.” And it seems the PCR process, being one step removed from the culture process, can be “gamed” to provide whatever results needed.
Both documents make that same causality claim and fail to reference it.
I also FOIA’d the TAHC and the USDA, who has funded grants for some of the papers that failed to specify the source for the causality statement. I have received nothing from these agencies.
I discovered from reading the available papers that there are healthy animals that co-exist with this organism, and unhealthy/deceased animals (spontaneously aborted, infertile) who do not. So they cannot even show good correlation between the presence of the organism and the observed “disease.”
And because we are assured correlation does not equal causation, and extraordinary claims (of causation) require extraordinary evidence, then the lack of references for the causality statements is highly suspect.
What I also discovered in the papers I read, was that to diagnose an “infection,” and label the animal “diseased,” the ONLY requirement is that the T. foetus organism be found in a sample of bull smegma collected by a vet (likely trained at TAMU) and cultured in a lab (likely the one at TAMU).
And my perfectly healthy bull, merely on the basis of the presence of a particular organism, can be labeled “infected” and “diseased,” but “asymptomatic.”
And the TAHC, comprised of BIG AG political appointees, can then FORCE me to MURDER (“cull”) my perfectly healthy bull.
All based on that CAUSALITY statement that they have no proof for.
So, you can see, this is a means for the big players here to profit ($$ for the vet, $$ for the lab, $$ for the patent-holders, $$ for the university, etc.) AND a means to commit state-sponsored tyranny against small farmers (who ultimately pay all the $$) and restrict the competition from the small farmers, who cannot remove themselves from the BIG AG food system if they are forced to cull perfectly healthy breeding stock.
So, no, I refuse to participate in this genocide against an organism that should be innocent until PROVEN guilty (the relationship could be neutral or beneficial, but without a thorough investigation no one can say otherwise).
SHOW ME YOUR PROOF OF CAUSATION USING THE SCIENTIFIC METHOD, DEFINITIVELY RULING OUT ALL OTHER POSSIBLE CAUSES.
Otherwise you can fuck right the hell off.
I am focused now on FMD, but a very brief comment. In Trichomonas infected herds, the bull will normally be a symptomless carrier and the most cows will clean themselves via immunity, and fertility can be normal. But if you sell the bull to an uninfected herd, embryonic mortality and venereal inflamations in the cows may happen. The buyer of a free herd will normally ask for a certificate, no idea why the state interferes. Well, in fact I know: everywhere in the West bureaucrats are taking over to make life in the countryside impossible. In Spain you can't have your own hens, and feeding a dead chicken to a farm dog can cost you an enormous fine (like E 50.000), other countries are advancing in the same direction.
It is part of the global domination plan that I describe in my book en articles.
“Symptomless,” or “asymptomatic,” means HEALTHY. They pulled that same BS with CON-VID.
They simply redefine words. A “positive” result from a “test” means NOTHING when the organism they are testing for is not PROVEN to be the CAUSE of anything. It’s a scam, a fraud. They freely admit they have no proof and have never done a thorough investigation to rule out other causes. They simply declare that T. foetus is THE CAUSE. That is NOT science. That’s DOGMA.
Again, feel free to read the available studies yourself. Normal healthy animals are found to carry the organism and animals that are infertile (or aborted) do not.
See: https://www.microbiologyresearch.org/content/journal/jmmcr/10.1099/jmmcr.0.000028
Note that this is a "Case Review" and not a scientific study. However, the Introduction paragraph makes this claim, "Tritrichomonas foetus, the causative organism," yet provides no citation.
Note that only 4.5% of aborted foetuses were positive. That means that 95.5% of abortions were negative. That is a very low correlation and not at all indicative of causation.
The Conclusion, "Our data collectively demonstrates that a percentage of cows/heifers that recently experienced abortion are positive for T. foetus and may play an important role in maintaining endemicity of bovine trichomoniasis."
Notice the language demonstrating a lack of correlation, as only a "percentage of cows" that aborted were positive.
They do not have SCIENTIFIC PROOF of anything. These papers do not even claim to be proof of anything.
They are playing word games, redefining “diseased” as simply a “positive” result from a test they gamed.
I’m no longer just playing along.
You can believe whatever the hell you want.
But the moment you, the scientific community, the government, or anyone else tries to pass off a belief as irrefutable scientific fact—or tries to coerce me or others into that belief system—you’d better be able to provide crystal-clear, irrefutable, empirical evidence for every cause-and-effect claim it rests on. Not models. Not expert consensus. Not majority opinion. Real, observable, testable evidence that follows the scientific method, step by step, for every single claim.
And if you can’t back it with real evidence, we don’t owe your belief a damn thing.
“Symptomless,” or “asymptomatic,” means HEALTHY
there is also a carrier state, where the animal (or human) is healthy, but can transmit a disease
Again, are you just going to keep repeating bullshit, or do you have any evidence?
They’ve already admitted they have no proof of causation. They’ve already admitted they have never done a thorough investigation to rule out anything.
They just declare the cause and we are just expected to believe without question as if it were handed down by the almighty himself.
And if I have to repeat myself:
That’s not science, that’s dogma.
Believe whatever you want. I will continue to require proof before I believe anything these liars and grifters say.
Right on the money!
Yes, a symptomless animals is healthy... for now. It may even remain healthy for its entire life. Or a virus may cause problems at a later date.
I've been raising dairy goats for 42 years. With goats, there is a virus called Caprine arthritis encephalitis virus, or CAE. This virus seems to remain symptomless in some 80% of infected goats, but for the other 20% it can cause serious illness (wasting disease, crippling arthritis, infertility, mastistis, etc.) and death. It has also been observed that encephalitis caused by CAE tends to strike kids between the ages of 2 to 6 months although it can occur in older animals, while the arthritis tends to strike older does, usually between the ages of 7 and 8.
Since the primary way this virus spreads is from dam to kids through the colostrum and milk, the best way to prevent it (aside from keeping a CAE-free herd with no outbreeding... it can also be transmitted sexually although this is rare) is to remove the kids as soon as they're born and pasteurize the colostrum and milk before feeding it to them.
Now go ahead and tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about in spite of my experience as a goatherder.
Thanks Dominique
I a very familiar with CAE. In the 80ties, a Dutch colleague imported to Mozambique a Nubian male lamb to improve local goats. In those days CAE was not yet well known, and the buck or herd where it came from had not been tested. In the end I reared it, but it never developed well. In the end it was was given a number of local does but the symptoms of CAE became evident in the buck. It was decided to kill off the whole herd, as CAE was supposedly not present in the country.
When in Costa Rica, I had a cheese plant and made very good cheeses, also of bought goat milk. I then tried to set up a CAE free herd by first detecting free herds and than buying up animals. But CAE won. The CAE positive herd was moved to another farm, had many positive animals but never clinical problems.
Let us guess: the "CAE virus" is detected with what? A test?
https://waddl.vetmed.wsu.edu/2023/02/07/cae-caprine-arthritis-encephalitis/
->
https://tests.waddl.vetmed.wsu.edu/Tests/Details/8134
Oh, an ANTIBODY test. Good lord. "When your goat has the virus antibodies it's infected."
Circular reasoning to start with and then we find out it's an antibody test. Case closed, you don't know what you're talking about.
the veterinary profession sure lost a great researcher with you
Antibody tests are not only highly cross reactive it is an acknowledged problem that lot-to-lot tests are unreliable. The reproducibility crisis in science affects antibody test kits too. Also in theory that could just as well demonstrate "immunity" not "persistent infection."
You're an idiot. Case closed.
Hi Mees -- would you want to debate Daniel Roytas on virology? https://www.vaccinesandchristianity.org/2024/09/20/2-interviews-that-may-challenge-your-belief-in-viruses/
I mostly agree with Daniel, especially on vaccines, and even more o vaccines in the hands of the Global Mafia, as is the reality
If he has read my new piece and still wants to debate me, he is welcome
One thing I have noticed over the years of research I have done, the older research is much more reliable.
Just as the honest "science" Kory and colleagues did on the Covid battle field, versus the many dishonest CRT studies on ivermectin showing that it had no effect.
Well, I was talking about how, as you said in one of your post, the information space is cluttered with misinformation, disinformation, and complete science fantasy lies and such. Before say the 1950's it was at least easier to sort the wheat from the chaff.
Whether or not viruses are real or imaginary, I tend to disagree with your final statement: "But artificially enhanced or modified human and zoonotic viruses still represent a great danger!" I think the danger comes for the deliberate murder of millions (soon to be billions) of people by (as you call them) the Glafia (globalist elite). Fear of "Disease X", supposedly caused by a deadly virus, as the excuse for government enforced weapons of mass vaccination.
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1964: Club of Rome founder Aurelio Peccei and banker David Rockefeller meet in Williamsburg, VA, at Bilderberg Conference to begin the merger between globalist finance and worldwide population reduction.
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1990s: Rapid development of vaccines as what billionaires view as a means of societal control, Big Pharma enrichment, and population reduction through a vast drop in male fertility, threatening mankind. Also, growth of stress-related chronic illness, deaths from iatrogenic causes, and deaths and injuries from adverse drug reactions, including explosion of autism in children.
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2009: The “Good Club,” a gathering of U.S. billionaires led by Bill Gates, David Rockefeller, and George Soros meets at Rockefeller University in New York to continue planning for worldwide population reduction. Group has been meeting for a decade.
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2020: On January 30, the World Health Organization announces a global emergency due to spread of COVID-19. On March 13, President Donald Trump declares a nationwide emergency and issues an additional travel ban on non-U.S. citizens traveling from 26 European countries due to what many will later call the COVID-19 “Plandemic.” Introduction of mRNA vaccines results in millions of excess deaths worldwide. COVID lockdowns shatter U.S. economy, destroying small businesses and causing massive unemployment.
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2023: Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., launches campaign for the presidency of the U.S., seeking first the Democratic nomination but switching to becoming an independent after being blocked from participation in Democratic Party primaries. Kennedy had published best-selling exposé of the misdeeds of Anthony Fauci in his book, The Real Anthony Fauci, Bill Gates, Big Pharma, and the Global War on Democracy, and Public Health.
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2024: Evidence continues to mount worldwide that billions of people have been poisoned by COVID vax, leading to rising death tolls from turbo-cancers, myocarditis and heart failure, amyloidosis, and “Long-COVID” effects. Deaths and injuries have also resulted from COVID medical treatment protocols, denial of known COVID remedies, and Draconian lockdown policies. Evidence also rises of aggressive globalist plans to crash world economy via carbon-capture, banning of meat, sequestering of farmland, and other attacks on the world food supply.
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This brings us to the inescapable observation that the quintessence of the Empire’s plan has been to assure the permanent wealth and power of its ruling billionaires by drastic reductions in the world’s population. The process has been underway since the 1960s, when it was discovered that gain-of-function bioengineering could be performed on viruses to make them more lethal(* see below). The population could also then be frightened into taking an increasing diet of harmful vaccines. {Richard C. Cook}
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https://www.globalresearch.ca/world-war-iii-is-on-but-the-empire-has-already-lost-an-american-civil-war-looms-spiritual-transformation-is-the-only-way-to-prevent-extinction/5868285
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(*)A psy-op weapon is only useful when shrouded in secrecy and prohibition, i.e. “rattled” and not deployed. The secrecy and prohibition also encourage fantastical doomsday mythology, helpfully stoked by the Hollywood’s predictive programming material. Human imagination is the most powerful weapon in existence, and the key to using it against others is to create catchy fake narratives about secret weapons programs that you may or may not have, and then let others convince themselves on your behalf and are forced to act along the predicted policies and incentives.
Thus, tales of gain-of-function (GOF) viruses that are kept in secret biolabs are one of the most effective fake stories to ever infect (see what I did here?) the human narrative spaces.
Finally, I do not accept arguments “but they have all the secret science and secret research in secret biolabs in Ukraine, etc. etc.” There is no evidence of any working GOF, but lots of evidence of the PCR/DNA modeling bullshit used to generate virus fearporn and clickbait, both in peer review literature and on social media. {Sasha Latypova}
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https://substack.com/home/post/p-159307261
Many good points, MArk
But this is about one question: does FMD virus exist, YES or NO?
If not, please specify your arguments!
Sorry Mark, I did not read your comment on the danger of bioweapons vs. a newly created virus/vax well. This is a war on many fronts, and we should not exclude any as we try to look in future risks.
The book L’Avenir De La Vie {“The Future of Life” (1981) ~ Michel Salomon} quotes Jacques Attali, adviser to French President François Mitterrand:
“In the future it will be about finding a way to reduce the population. We will start with the old, because as soon as he is over 60-65 years of age, man lives longer than he produced and costs society dearly. Then the weak and then the useless who do nothing for society because there will be more and more of them, and especially finally the stupid ones.”
”... euthanasia will have to be an essential instrument of our future societies, in all cases. Of course, we cannot execute people or set up camps. We will get rid of them by making them believe it is for their own good. Too large a population, and for the most part unnecessary, is something economically too expensive.”
“We will find something to cause it, a pandemic that targets certain people, a real economic crisis or not, a virus that will affect the old or the obese, it doesn’t matter, the weak will succumb to it, the fearful and the stupid will believe it and ask to be treated. We will have taken care to have planned the treatment, a treatment that will be the solution. The selection of idiots will thus be done by themselves: they will go to the slaughterhouse on their own." {Robin Westenra Substack (September 2024)}.
Reportedly, Henry Kissinger said something similar at a 1990s conference: that once people are made to accept vaccines, it’s “game over.”
Happy Easter! and God bless you.
Thanks!
that's the opening quote of a chapter in my book
B30 | Culling the herd: the depopulation agenda
here's the page https://rairfoundation.com/the-real-globalist-mastermind-behind-the-great-reset-prophet-jacques-attali/ with astonishing stuff!!
Hello Mees - Do you happen to know if FMD occurs in apparently healthy wild animals?
It would be interesting to see if that is true or not.
If wild animals do not have FMD, then what would be the cause of FMD in domesticated animals?
Maybe how they are born and raised?
Maybe their diet?
Maybe many generations of hybridization have weakened their general strength and integrity, and perhaps their immune systems in some manner?
Hi Robert, FMD may affect all cloven-hoofed animals, domestic and wild.
It can survive for a long time in recovered animals, see van Bekkum, J. G. 1959. Observation on the carrier state of cattle exposed to FMDV. Tijdschr. Diergeneeskd. 84; 1159-1164. and Fogedby, E. 1963. Review of epizootiology and control of foot-and-mouth disease in Europe 1937 to 1961. European commision for the control of foot-and-mouth disease, food and agricultural organisation of the United Nations, Rome, 1963.
It can be spread by the wind over dozens of kilometers. In Holland, most outbreaks used to be in the summer months, when the cattle were day and night in pasture, a season in which many other diseases disappear.
AS far as I know only immunity after vaccination of disease protects, but their are several types and strains without cross immunity.
To complete my answer, this disease has been known for centuries, far before modern cattle breeds and production systems evolved.
Anyone claiming that "a disease" "was known about" in the 1600s, 1700s, 1400s, etc. that would be comparable to "a disease" "identified" in the 1800s or 1900s is making wild claims. Symptoms, maybe, yes.
The symptoms are very specific. It is however similar to vesicular stomatitis (also due to a virus), but the former does not infect horses, while the latter does.
Interestingly enough at the time FMD was discovered people were enthusiastically submerging their livestock in arsenic-based livestock dips (e.g., Cooper's sheep dip) and administering arsenic based anti-pesticidal medications, and spraying the ever-living 💩 out of their food, livestock feed, and soil with arsenic-based pesticides. Which is funny because dermal and ingested arsenic poisoning can cause a wide variety of symptoms in humans and animals identical to various pox diseases, necrotic anthrax-like or even FMD-like skin lesions, cancers, keratosis, measles-type rashes, nerve damage, and we could go on.
Thought to be totally safe at the time, we now understand that these chemicals enthusiastically used from the 1850s to 1980s (!!) are extraordinarily toxic, can cause both chronic and acute disease, and are prone to environmental accumulation that has led to persistent soil and water poisoning to this day.
And that's just the arsenic. Lord knows how many other toxic junk chemicals people and livestock were being exposed to at the time, whether accidentally (industrial pollution) or on purpose (some purported miracle cure or "totally safe herb/pesticide").
Guaranteed controlling for environmental toxins was never - and almost still has never - been accounted for in past or current "virus" studies.
One also wonders if they did "controls" of a more basic nature: e.g., does injecting non-"infected" diluted lymph into animal tongues cause lesions, and so on. It's actually quite likely that grinding up some lymph or tongue from a healthy animal and injecting it into your or an animals tongues would "make it sick." Having looked into rabies, influenza, polio, measles, and varicella, I'm going to confidently guess the answer for FMD is: "no".
livestock dipping is mostly done as a routine in (problematic) tick infested areas, not in Western Europe where FMD was frequent.
I appreciate your inquiry, a rare event in these discussions! FMD has been known for centuries, long before large scale applications of pesticides.
Loeffler was the first researcher who showed that the causal agent is not a toxin, but a very small replicating (bio)particle (original documents in German). If you have a sufficiently virulent strain, you can inject a first animal (say a calf of 200 kg) with 1/10.000 ml of infected lymph, than from the second 200 kg animal the same quantity to the third, and so on, and on. A toxin would be extremely diluted in such passages and lose its toxicity, which is dose dependent.
Loeffler used the term lymph for the clear fluid in the FMD lesion (blister) on the tongue (so not as a generic term). Injections of non-FMD material (including blood or serum) have never resulted in the disease, which normally (virulence may vary in different types and strains of the virus) spreads like fire to other cattle or pigs in the affected herd or area.
The arguments used today by no-virus leaders on the only way a virus could be isolated are thus obsolete: Loeffler already proved it, although he could not see the particles. We now know this virus at the atomic level, including its genome, see the last article mentioned in this post.
From the Journal of Wildlife Disease...
FOOT AND MOUTH DISEASE: A LOOK FROM THE WILD SIDE
https://meridian.allenpress.com/jwd/article/49/4/759/125500/FOOT-AND-MOUTH-DISEASE-A-LOOK-FROM-THE-WILD-SIDE
Hahaha so it's "asymptomatic" in the wild. That figures.
You are truly a genius! In the abstract it readss:
... in some wild ungulates, infection results in severe disease ....
"wildlife has not been demonstrated to play a significant role in the maintenance of FMD. More often, wildlife are passively infected"
So that would constitute "asymptomic" right?
So you don't know how to read?
Good question. A straight answer would have been nice.
I think perhaps the cause is unhygienic conditions when animals are confined in captivity. If you have to stamp around in your own urine and feces and have a lesion on your foot or tongue? The disease typically spreads between animals through direct contact. This would mean FMD is less common in wild deer, pigs, antelopes, gazelles, goats etc.
I put this forward in terms of the cause of human bubonic plague (black death):
"Anaphylaxis explains both natural outbreaks of “contagious illness” in human history and chronic illness in modern western populations. Because normally people carry the plague bacteria and cholera bacteria in their intestines and it's no problem. But when rats, lice and fleas were common, their bites carried proteins found in sewage. In effect bites were the equivalent of being "vaccinated"; and enough bites would cause an “epidemic” of the plague/ smallpox/ cholera etc."
{Sasha Latypova (September 3rd 2024)}
https://sashalatypova.substack.com/p/the-second-shot-or-what-do-vaccinators
Apparent spread of FMD by the wind may in fact be due to flying insect bites? The insects being carried by the wind. This is, of course, just a guess.
Mark and Others - All the points raised here are well-taken. They all help to paint the bigger picture.
Bottom line, from my POV: Once humankind created Agriculture and Animal Husbandry, which are both strictly (and severely) anti-natural practices, humankind has been fighting Nature ever since. Deliberately upsetting natural, optimal balances in countless ways, of course we find ourselves confronted with all manner of symptoms and diseases, due to perverted imbalances we have created.
Anti-natural practices = unpleasant consequences.
That's Natural Law in action.
As it should be.
Arguing over details, whilst blithely continuing our anti-natural practices, appears ridiculous, delusional, and certainly counter-productive.
In the end, Nature will win. Guaranteed.
Best if we stop the war now.
What to do about it?
The sensible answer is to carefully study how Nature wants to do things, and biomimic those techniques. IOW, do everything we can to rehabilitate natural ecosystems, along with our own lifestyle practices to be in much better harmony with Nature's methods.
How to do that?
We can write volumes.....
More likely some kind of poison producing so-called FMD symptoms. Arsenic could be one culprit, or one of the other dangerous chemical/heavy metal contaminents in use. By the 1920s fertiliser use had taken hold and fertilised fields deprive animals of the full complement of minerals needed for optimal health and longevity.
There is no proof for viruses. The virus hoax is the number one thing keeping humanity in chains.
Dr Sam Bailey has some excellent content, read her book Virus Mania. Ditto the book The Contagion Myth. Anthony Colpo on substack -"Viruses don't exist, deal with it", well worth your time.
read the f...ing article!
science does not prescribe certain methodologies or techniques, just logical reasoning.
Maybe it helps when you read my piece?
That's the science trick they taught you when you did your PhD at the No-Virus Institute, just as Pharmafia applies science tricks
"Pseudoscience consists of statements, beliefs, or practices that claim to be both scientific and factual but are incompatible with the scientific method"
Copied from wikipedia. Of all places.
"Pseudoscience describes any belief system or methodology which tries to gain legitimacy by wearing the trappings of science but fails to abide by the rigorous methodology and standards of evidence that are the marks of true science.
Promoters of pseudoscience often adopt scientific vocabulary, describing conjectures as hypotheses, theories, or laws, providing "evidence" from observation and "expert" testimonies, or even developing what appear to be mathematical models of their ideas. However, in pseudoscience, there is no honest attempt to follow the scientific method, provide falsifiable predictions, or develop double-blind experiments.
Although pseudoscience is designed to appear scientific, it lacks all of the substance of science."
Well said. Copied from:
https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Pseudoscience
Yes I agree, an excellent description of the no virus theory!
This is what I just wrote to guy wants me to debate Mike Stone (no idea who he is):
as I have explained ad nauseam, no-virus uses a "science trick", similar to what Fauci and Pharmafia do: they define a set of arbitrary hurdles, ABC.., for a virus to pass, in such a way that no virus can ever pass (I call it the Cowan gold standard). ABC are time-bound and technique-bound. Then they conclude: easy peasy, viruses don't exist.
I have certainly no interest to participate in a debate where the dogma is ABC, and then ABC, and again, ABC.
But I will participate in a debate where Loeffler's method is critically analyzed to see if there are logical fallacies. Logic is not time-bound and not technique-bound. As is science.
Mike Stone belongs to "the club". He's one of those big names in "no-virus".
Let's hope you will reject his offer. Personally I don't see much value in debating virology. If you would want to engage in any discussions, at least talk to honest people.
It's nice to hear you agree that science does prescribe the scientific method.
And by the way, "no-virus" is NOT a theory.
Your hard headed genius is still not getting it!
ABC is not science, but arbitrary scientism. When you say it's not a theory, you mean that it is the truth. And not just a truth, a truth that cannot be discussed. Great science!
and by the way, in a scientific discussion, you should have excused yourself for your ridiculous comment on wild animals!
Mike does critically analyse Loeffler's method here. Perhaps you'd like to comment. https://mikestone.substack.com/p/the-virus-concept?utm_source=publication-search
As regards the science trick of making viruses impossible to prove I disagree. The scientific method is designed so that people can't just go round saying there's evidence for a thing when there isn't.
Mike Stone does not mention the proof that the agent replicates in the host. That is only one of the big lies by team no-virus.
I do not have time to answer your 15 comment in 12 hours,, here is my standard comment (but I will read them all to see if there is any new argument in it).
Dear commenter
I have been answering hundreds of comments on my no-virus articles and was often insulted. I have made two conclusions, which are now my standard answer (personalized answers will be the exception):
1. The leaders of team no-virus are clearly acting in bad faith: all their publications are misleading and riddled with contradictions, falsifications, omissions, etc. These errors can’t be random and the only explanation that I can give is that they are part of a psy-op, set up and financed by The Powers That Be. That is nothing new: it has been seen in all opposition movements, i.e., cognitive infiltration as described by Cass Sunstein: … agents should join those online communities and promote a wide range of additional theories, often rather absurd ones, thereby stirring up internal conflicts, diverting the members into theoretical dead-ends, and heavily discrediting them with the broader public.
2. The followers of team no-virus often make ad hominem attacks, probably because they learned it from Tom Cowan, and because their backgrounds in medicine and virological science are – with rare exceptions – insufficient for an academic discussion. Yet their attitude is rarely humble. For the same reason they are also unable to spot the enormous deceit by the leaders. Most of these rude attackers have a quite recent substack account without original posts, but with a facade of restacks. Some have even offered me money, or cooperation with their leaders in research projects. Again, all of this smells psy-op.
And of course, nobody has taken the Loeffler challenge. Please tell me what else can explain his results, if not a virus (a submicroscopic agent replicating in the host)?
On the misleading publications:
After a quick screening I spotted 3 mayor deceptions in Can you catch a cold, see my post The proof of NO no-virus.
On The Contagion Myth, see this polite but devastating critique https://www.natureinstitute.org/article/craig-holdrege-and-jon-mcalice/some-comments-on-the-contagion-myth
Then there are the hundreds of pages of polite and patient, and very detailed and rational refutations of no-virus theory by Jeremy Hammond,
https://www.jeremyrhammond.com/articles/collections/virus/
I am not saying that Covid was not a hoax or a scam (it was), or that vaccines are good (they are dangerous and largely unnecessary), or that viruses are a mayor health risk for humans (that was long ago), or that the pharmaceutical industry is benevolent: in my book I call them Pharmafia: the New Merchants of Death. I am just saying that viruses do exist (including Covid19), that they can be modified into bioweapons, and that anti-viral drugs can be lifesaving.
I don't care what Mike Stone does or doesn't say, you're talking to me.
Let me try and explain it like this. Say a toxin, stress or malnutrition causes the body to protect itself with blisters. You mash up the affected area which contains all the cellular stimulants to produce blisters and directly inject (or some other unnatural transmission route) into another animal of the same species (or different) and hey presto blisters are produced. You then mash up the affected area of the second animal and using the same dilution of the cellular stimulants inject into a third animal and hey presto, what a surprise get blisters.
The ‘agent’ does not replicate in the host? You understand the concept of hormones, mRNA and cell messaging etc. The stimulus causes the body to react in a certain way - make a runny nose etc. If these were transferred to another organism they may well cause a runny nose.
I suggest you read my article
To have something to eat requires the thing, without the thing, there's nothing to eat. What do virologists put on the plate? Nothing. There are three lines of evidence which they say points to the thing, but not the thing itself. Your argument is a screaming nonsense.
Please stop uttering distractions!
This is the hour of truth: does FMD virus exist, YES or NO?
If not, specify your arguments, because this is about science!
If you have nothing relevant to say, please shut up!
You are a fraud.
why are there no viruses? because there are no viruses! impressive and genius!
PLease stop commenting here
Total trash bro. You really can’t let get go of the viral delusion. That’s because you also still think you live on a ridiculous spinning, spiraling ball zooming through an ever expanding vacuum of space at beyond mind blowing speeds. Take a deep breath, it’s so simple. The earth does not move and viruses are not the cause of disease. The rest is for you to figure out, but I doubt you ever will.
Please stop uttering distractions!
This is about one question: does FMD virus exist, YES or NO?
If not, specify your arguments!
If you have nothing relevant to say, please shut up!
A living and replicating life form that causes disease that you call a virus does not exist. You are the one making the baseless claim. All the procedures are based on flawed assumptions and procedures like all virology. You have not proved anything. I do not, and shall not prove that something doesn't exist. All the information on this ridiculous viral nonsense has been thoroughly dismantled. I am not wasting my breath on you. You have nothing just like all that went before you. You are part of the problem, fuelling the useless poisons as a solution. You are afraid to take responsibility for your own health choices, and need a terrorist to blame. You have learned nothing during the last 5 years of the Convid Scamdemic farce. Not one virus has EVER EVER EVER been ISOLATED, never mind proven to cause disease.
why do you keep wasting your gunpowder on an idiot like me?
does it pay well?
👍👍👍
Hi Mees, I wonder if that 1916 New York poliovirus outbreak may have actually been the result of testing vaccines. I have gone through some of the Rockefeller reports from around that time and those scientist were doing many "interesting" and unethical experiments. Since this was originally blamed on a group of immigrants, I wondered if vaccines were administered on Ellis Island. Turns out that "by 1916 the Ellis Island laboratory routinely prepared vaccines". I could not find out for what. But given that vaccines were widely tested on service members, incarcerated individual, orphans and the like - I would not put it past them. Millions were coming through and they could justify such experiments on this "lower class of people" as for the greater good.
Suzanne Humpfries says that the lab had the Rockefeller given task to develop a highly lethal poliovirus type (just an accident, but maybe for fear mongering, to make people receptive to vaccines). I cite her, so maybe you can ask her. The problems with the polio vaccines are from much later, the 50ties (Salk). All very well explained in Suzanne's book.
Yes I have read her book. What I was trying to find out is were they running vaccine trials for polio at this time. But they were testing vaccines for all sorts of diseases. Chas. M Higgins book (1920) "Horrors of Vaccination Exposed and Illustrated :Petition to the President to abolish compulsory vaccination in the Army and Navy - detailed some of these practices at the time. Many unknowns - Thanks
Yes, Covid was not the first compulsary vaccination. Yesterday I read somewhere that compulsary vaccination for Smallpox in the UK was abolished in 1898! Vax rates drops, yet the disease was quickly retreating.
Below is the link to the Higgins 1919-1920 book - some great info. https://archive.org/details/39002086340891.med.yale.edu
Thanks!
Don't rule out pollution and pesticides. The Western world spend about 150 years spewing arsenic, lead, and other toxic heavy metals into drinking water, into and onto livestock, onto crops, into the soil, into lumber, into paints and dyes and fabrics, into detergents, and into cosmetics. Either via chemical spills or especially under the guise of pesticides. To say nothing of the "medicines" of the time (mercury, arsenic, etc.) and the ridiculous "tests" used to "diagnose disease", or the "mercury based teething salts" people liked to give babies, and so on.
There's a million and one possible explanations given people's enthusiasm for drenching themselves in highly toxic chemicals.
Hi Mees, could any infection be caused by toxins resulting from the actual method of transmission rather than assuming the presence of a virus just as adjuvants can be problematic with vaccine production.
Please reformulate your question and split it up in two or more parts, because I don't get your point
Merely Mees, that in any experiment there is a chance of an error due to extraneous circumstances like contamination. The lymph extraction and purification can lead to corrupted results with misleading conclusions. The COVID test had a noticeable error rate which completely skewed the interpretation of a positive test.
you write:
"The lymph extraction and purification can lead to corrupted results with misleading conclusions."
Yes, that's why they took hygienic measures in the collection and filtered the bacteria out, and added several tests for sterility mentioned in the original articles, not in mine. (and in the US document too if I remember well). They were totally aware that this could happen and treated it with "Deutsche Grundlichkeit".
An observation made by Loeffler is that even when a lymph was contaminated, passage through one or more animals would rapidly clear it.
PCR: I agree
You know it's virtually impossible to get published without being in line with pharma dogma. Pharma was very happy to ban and thus create a market for IVM and get those rejecting the jabs popping it like sweets.
You seem to have fallen hook line and sinker.
What is your picture of? They look like ladybirds or some sort of bugs. Why does it say VIRAL LOAD underneath. What paper is it from? What is it stained with and what's the magnification? If they're meant to be viruses and it's EM you know that electrons only produce a negative impression in black and white so it's been colourised?
this is virus humor, bugs from the garden, if you look well you can see heads and antennas.
viruses like jokes? or have heads?
Our sense of humor seems to be quite different.
Your 128 year old lesson in virology teaches us how the scientific method can be subverted. It does not prove the existence of replication competent transmissible pathogenic particles.
Blisters, spots and fever are, of course, the body's way of healing, detoxing and protecting itself from whatever assaults are involved in farming animals. They are produced by the body itself. Taking filtered lymph from blisters will contain the substances, micro RNA and protein or whatever, that cause the healing mechanisms.
Injecting, scarifying or ingesting these substances will, of course, cause the same reactions in others, or symptoms may be as a result of the assault of injection, scarification or ingestion. Controls were not done 'infecting' animals with fluid from blisters thought not to be caused by FMD virus etc.
Animals also communicate with each other by visual and many other cues to detox so 'natural' means of transmission, like yawning, can appear 'contagious'.
Yes, passage of these substances through different species of cell would make them more 'virulent' ie reacting to the stress of all the toxins and stresses used in the abnormal process of cell culture.
The substances that act like 'HIV" can only be produced by treating cell cultures in a certain way.
Are you saying that specific, isolated, independent variable was intramuscularly or intravenously injected into animals as proof of natural contagion?
you haven't even read my text ...
That's a logical fallacy Mees...it not only avoids my question, but it also sets up the proposition that not reading the text is proof of the texts' veracity.